Before thanksgiving, I read a lot
of facebook posts about how to avoid over the election at Thanksgiving. Some
suggested you change topic by rallying everyone to steal the neighbor’s lawn
furniture. Still, one conversation after
another came my way. Some of my
frustration is toward Obama who shut down Occupy and kept Black Lives Matter at
an arm’s length. Frances Fox Piven has
long said Obama needs a movement. And he
certainly could have embraced these movements, expanding the conversation,
reaching out to labor, etc. Instead he
hired Lawrence
Summers, embraced the best and brightest and put these movements at
bay.
But thinking about Trump and
Republicans, I started thinking about AIDS and the years when my friends were
dying. And the government did
nothing. Then the Bush years came and
it got worse. Poor people, people with
AIDS, Hepatitis C, Trans folks, those on the margins suffered in countless ways
as the year Reagan/Bush/Bush years wore on.
I worry about the Friedrichs case
coming back to the supreme court, about the Paris deal over the climate
crumbling. And over the image of the US as a caring place. Today, I feel like we live in an occupied
territory.
So the weekend continued, we
hiked and talked about Sly and the Family Stone, who Al told stories about, some
of the best he ever saw when Sly showed up, or completed the show. When he didn’t things could get messy. Riots
sometimes followed, as legend goes.
Before it all started I posted a
note on FB about the electoral college.
And a world of conversation grew from there, between myself and an old
football buddy. The conversation grew
from there.
Happy thanksgiving everyone. So 100,000 people in Wisconsin,
Pennsylvania, and Michigan are more important than the two million more people
who voted for HRC. And we end up with a very scary anti democratic racist
despot. Isn't this when the electoral college is actually supposed to step in
and do the right thing. Do the right thing electoral college. Vote for the
person who won the most votes who actually cares about our systems of laws and
institutions. Why doesn't my vote in NYC count as much as a vote in the
Midwest? Its like we're still living with the Three-Fifths Compromise here.
WTF?
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7 Comments
Comments
Mark Leger Yes. And I would love to
see a demographic analysis of this inequity.
Chad Dunston Ben, even MSNBC and CNN
called the election "The Race to 270". It wasn't "The Race to 270....unless
we don't get our way". Be thankful we are in a country where everyone's
vote counts and not just the blue coasts. If you want the electoral to
essentially throw the election, you are worse than a despot. Nobody hated the
electoral college the morning of November 8 when Hillary was predicted to
collect over 300. I know it's tough, but take a step back and remove yourself
from the rhetoric and BS because the belly aching and ranting can be seen as
insulting sometimes. And I know you mean well.
Unlike · Reply · 1 · November 24 at 2:33pm
Benjamin Heim Shepard i hear you
chad. why not have a popular voteChad Dunston? what about the two million more
people who voted for hrc? the state of ny sends more to the federal government
than we get back and now it looks like our votes count less? and not
everyone's...See More
Like · Reply · November 25 at 8:34am · Edited
John Welch I think a lot of people
have hated the electoral college for a long time. It's not as though these are
the agreed upon rules of the game and dems are sore losers. These are rules no
one currently alive participated in setting. They were inherited f...See More
Chad Dunston Benjamin Heim
Shepard
If there were a popular vote, candidates would never campaign in between a line from NYC to LA and Chicago to Miami. Texas is the exception because it has a large population outside of greater Houston and Dfw. You would have a c...See More
If there were a popular vote, candidates would never campaign in between a line from NYC to LA and Chicago to Miami. Texas is the exception because it has a large population outside of greater Houston and Dfw. You would have a c...See More
Unlike · Reply · 1 · November 26 at 12:59am
Benjamin Heim Shepard Chad Dunston always good to hear from you
friend. We'll have to agree to disagree. But i agree. WE are too divided. Would
rather have us become a country of regional spaces. This doesn't work. I know
you would not be too happy if your side lead by...See More
Jeanne Hilary Chad Dunsten I'm not
against the electoral college for the reasons you cite. But the logic of the EC
was devised when the majority of Americans didn't live in cities; now we do,
over 65% of the US population is urban. Urban voters voted for Clinton
by ...See More
Chad Dunston Sorry you're terrified.
I'm also sorry you live in a world where you believe so much make believe. But
have fun!!
Benjamin Heim Shepard Chad Dunston thats a bit of an ad hominem
comment. People use them when the rational of their points disappears so they
resort to name calling. I thought that was what you were trying to avoid.
Chad Dunston How am I name calling?
The poster proved my point anyway. She believes the urban vote is more
important than the rural one. That's as elitist and dismissive as it gets.
Brian Griffin If you can't see how
you just called Benjamin delusional,
i.e. ad hominem, one wonders what else is missing there. Let's try to keep this
conversation interesting for us readers only by keeping it on point.
Chad Dunston Ha! I called Ben
delusional? I have never done that to Ben. Don't see that. I simply pointed out
that the electoral process was acceptable until Hillary lost.
Write a reply...
Shirlene Cooper Happy Thanksgiving
Ben
Douglas Silver Here's a good article
about the math. If you live in Vermont, North Dakota or Wyoming, your vote
counts more mathematically than if you live in California, New York or Florida.
http://www.slate.com/.../presidential_election_a_map...
http://www.slate.com/.../presidential_election_a_map...
SLATE.COM|BY CHRIS KIRK
Like · Reply · Remove Preview · 3 · November 24 at 3:33pm
Jeanne Hilary Douglas Silver exactly.
This is how the Electoral College is supposed to work, in a system that
included the 3/5ths law and whose economy was mainly agricultural. It made
sense then to weight electoral power toward the areas with low populations but
which were responsible for the majority of the economic *production* in the
colonies that became the US. (Not the 3/5ths law--I'm not saying that). Today
that is not the case: the vast portion of US economic production takes place in
cities and states with large urban populations. Ergo my dodgeball analogy: EC
is not some idea of everybody gets a prize for participating. EC was also set
up to overrule the popular vote should the people, in the grip of some kind of
mob hysteria, elect an unfit, anti-democratic demagogue by a majority vote.
They didn't foresee a situation in which in a fit of mob hysteria a minority of
the voters, less than 25% of registered voters, could elect an unfit demagogue
who would make it to the White House only by strength of the institution
founded to prevent exactly this from happening. Trump and Clinton are not
candidates with different political philosophies; Clinton has the requisite
ability to be president, Trump does not. Let the whole world burn for the sole
reason that "it's always been done this way" is irresponsible, and
cowardice (on the part of the EC and the political establishment) nothing else.
Also, Clinton won the popular vote by a significant majority, so, apart from
precedent, this really should not be a heavy lift.
Chad Dunston Wow, Jeanne, now I'm
part of a mob. Awesome. Talk about delusional. All you folks need to face the
possibility that you are actually wrong. I know it's tough.
Anyway, apologies to Ben, but I can't argue with people with closed minds and unwilling hearts. But if you really want ad hominem, here's me pointing at the scoreboard and silently walking off the field.
Anyway, apologies to Ben, but I can't argue with people with closed minds and unwilling hearts. But if you really want ad hominem, here's me pointing at the scoreboard and silently walking off the field.
Jeanne Hilary Chad Dunston the words are those of the
founding fathers, not mine. Here are my words: you may have voted for Trump
because you wanted lower taxes, or because you hate Hillary Clinton, which
makes you an idiot. If you voted for Trump because you think a wall on the
Mexican border, or a registry for Muslims are good ideas, you're a bigot. In
both cases, and in light of your uninformed comments here, you're a fool,
because Trump isn't going to do any of that. The EC was established to protect
the republic from people like you. I just hope we all don't have to pay the
price for your ignorance and stupidity.
Chad Dunston Idiot. Bigot. Fool.
Stupid. That's what you just called me, yet you have no clue who I am.
That's the issue with people like you. You assume Trump voters are all of these things. You might want to actually entertain the possibility that people vote for other reasons. I don't think you can.
It couldn't be that Obamacare is a disaster. It couldn't be that our strategy to deal with ISIS has been inept. It couldn't be that people have not seen a raise in 15 years. It couldn't be that people don't want the policies of Obama to continue. And it certainly doesn't explain why democrats got destroyed across the board down ballot.
Look, I understand you're upset, and if insulting me personally makes you feel better, that's fine. I'm thick skinned. But you must understand that you are wrong on so many fronts. Mainly, I'm not a bigot or a fool. I can be an idiot and stupid at times, so I'll give you that.
That's the issue with people like you. You assume Trump voters are all of these things. You might want to actually entertain the possibility that people vote for other reasons. I don't think you can.
It couldn't be that Obamacare is a disaster. It couldn't be that our strategy to deal with ISIS has been inept. It couldn't be that people have not seen a raise in 15 years. It couldn't be that people don't want the policies of Obama to continue. And it certainly doesn't explain why democrats got destroyed across the board down ballot.
Look, I understand you're upset, and if insulting me personally makes you feel better, that's fine. I'm thick skinned. But you must understand that you are wrong on so many fronts. Mainly, I'm not a bigot or a fool. I can be an idiot and stupid at times, so I'll give you that.
Jeanne Hilary None of these reasons
justify voting for an incompetent, unfit candidate like Trump. I stand behind
what I said, and I speak for myself, not "people like me", the
preamble to every statement of bigotry. I have entertained quite a few reasons
why you may have voted for Trump, I would entertain as many as you like. That
doesn't change the fact that you were conned. You voted for chaos and
corruption. You voted for a national security disaster. I won't take up the
issues you raise which are opinions and which don't correspond to fact. You
really should try to get some knowledge, it's your responsibility as a citizen
of a democracy.
Write a reply...
Benjamin Heim Shepard Hey guys, Chad Dunston and i have been buddies for
over three decades together. We agree to disagree. Chad Dunston is none of these things
mentioned, except maybe a little impatient with the Cowboys coach when we were
losing. But we can all go from there. Thanks for a good chat everyone.
Everyone, can we stop the name calling. As for me, i think the republican party
is the party of citizens united deciding corporations are people and underminding
democracy, financial crisis, one after another, 2008 and 1929 and hostility to
social programs. But we can all agree to disagree. I hope we can find a way out
of this mess. And yes, Chad many of us have been mad about the antiquated
electoral college for a long time, long long before this round. But as a man
with values and a father, i do wonder how you could support Trump. Our
experience in New York is the guy has never cared an iota for anyone or thing
but himself, certainly not regular people. Go Dallas Cowboys!
Chad Dunston Thanks Ben.
I don't mind your rants. They come from a real place. I agree with you on about
30%. So one out of three ain't bad. Cowboys make me nervous. I can't take
another heart break.
Benjamin Heim Shepard You're the
best Chad Dunston! Have you followed up on your
commitment to stop watching games as long as Princeton is in charge? Anywqays,
take care friend.
Chad Dunston No. but I
give him zero credit for this.
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| After a weekend away, its always good to be back to holy Brooklyn, even if it isn't part of the rest of the USA, which is probably a good thing. |